Transcript

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Hey, there. Welcome to the Dr. Nina Show here on LA Talk Radio. I’m your host, Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin. And I’m here to help you stop counting caloris, carbs, and fat grams so you can easily get to your healthiest weight and get on with your life.

I want you to wake up and think about your day, not your diet. And to that end, the real problem with binge eating, stress eating, any kind of emotional eating, the real problem is not food. The real problem is not food. The real problem is what is eating at you.

So, sorry for the late start. We were trying to resolve our technology. I thought I was going to be able to be heard on Instagram today, but I guess not. I can be heard. My callers cannot be heard. But, we will get this resolved. Big thanks to Ronan, my heroic engineer, who’s trying to help me out from home. So, thank you, Ronan.

If you would like to join me here today, the number in … I was going to say in the studio. The number here in my home makeshift studio is (818) 602-4929. (818) 602-4929. Give me a call. Let me know what is eating at you, what is weighing on you. I’m here to help.

One of the things that I am hearing a lot today, and yesterday, and for weeks is how helpless people feel, how helpless they feel about this virus, how helpless they feel about the response to the virus, how helpless they feel about social unrest. They feel helpless. Big seismic shifts are happening in our world, in our society, in our health. And there’s the sense that you can’t do anything about it. There’s very little that you can do. And that’s why sometimes people say, “Well, you know I’m doing a lot with my time off. I’m writing three novels. I just started learning the piano. I’m doing, doing, doing, doing.” There’s nothing wrong with that, but it’s one of the response to helplessness. And sometimes there’s sort of a driven quality to it.

Helplessness is what we’re all feeling because of this COVID-19 situation. We are feeling helpless. The only thing we can do is protect ourselves and each other by wearing a mask.

 

By the way, I got masked shamed. I got mask shamed the other day. I was walking in my neighborhood with my BFF, and this guy who was not wearing a mask said to us, “Isn’t it hard to breathe while you’re wearing a mask?”

 

Now, what we should have said, looking back, we should’ve said, “Well, you know what’s really hard to breathe is when you’re on a ventilator. That is really hard.”

 

But, no, we didn’t. My BFF said, “Yes, it is heard to breathe.”

 

He said, “Well, why are you wearing that mask?”

 

She said, “Well, to protect you and me.”

 

And he actually got angry with us and told us it was ridiculous that we were wearing masks and basically just was irate and angry.

I thought, “Wow. Wow. That man is so angry because two women are wearing masks to protect themselves.” What is happening, people? What is happening?

 

I mean, we know what is happening. It’s this division. It’s politicized. It’s this denial. But, it’s real. And the reality is we are help … Oh, ModernWorldzen says, carry a mask with you and offer it to him. Yeah. I don’t want to get within six feet of that dude, let me tell you.

 

But, I hope I never see him again. I have a fairly big neighborhood. I’ve never seen him before, and I hope I never see him again because I might not be able to restrain myself and give him a bunch of CDC statistics and … None of which he wants to hear. He doesn’t want to believe that it’s a real problem. And of course it is.

We are helpless against this virus. And helplessness is one of the worst and most awful, awful, awful … I can’t say awful enough. The most awful experiences that we as humans can have, the sense of helplessness and powerlessness, that there is nothing we can do.

I’ve been hearing so many people talk about helplessness and how hard it is to feel helpless. So, I wanted to share with you some thoughts about helplessness and … Gosh, I hope you cannot hear the construction that’s going outside my window. It’s doing a radio show at home, people, while having things done to your house. So, hopefully you can hear me and not the construction guys.

So, helplessness is a feeling that most people cannot bear to experience, either on its own or because it intensifies other painful or upsetting feelings. Being helpless is defined as unable to help oneself, weak or dependent, deprived of strength or power, and incapacitated. The state of helplessness is connected to vulnerability and dependency, both of which can be extremely uncomfortable. This is what I wrote in my book, extremely uncomfortable. I guess if I were to rewrite my book, and I will change it for the second edition, I would say both of which can be extremely unbearable. Unbearable to be vulnerable and dependent.

Addiction specialist Lance Dodes, who you guys might’ve seen on MSNBC talking about number 45, he’s been a mentor to me. He’s a fellow psychoanalyst. He’s an author who writes extensively on addiction. He says people with addictions … Now, this is him talking about addictions. This is not me talking about food addictions, which I don’t believe in any way. He says the people with addictions are often overwhelmed by helpless feelings and driven to the addictive behavior as a way of reversing the helplessness. So as he explains it, addiction has long been deeply misunderstood in both our culture and clinic practice.

Rather than being a reflection of impulsivity or self-destructiveness, which is generally how it’s thought of, even by people who feel like addicts, they think they have no willpower, no control, or a result of genetic or physical factors, addiction can be shown to be a psychological mechanism that is a subset of psychological compulsions in general. What he says is that addictive urges are never random. And when you understand the emotional factors that underlie your behavior, addiction can be mastered.

So, what does all this mean to you? It means that sometimes when we feel helpless about something big, whether it’s the world situation or whether it’s something is big in intensity, we’re having troubles in our relationships, in our marriage, we’re lonely, we can’t see people, we can’t hug the people we love, we don’t feel connected, we don’t feel hope, those are all things that we have no agency over that we switch the experience of helplessness over these big issues, and conflicts, and experiences into helplessness over food or something else. Jenny called last week, and she talked about her sense of helplessness over rosé wine. So, it’s a way of managing helplessness that just ends up hurting us.

Dr. Dodes proposes that the feeling of helplessness is the foundation of the most painful and upsetting emotions. When you’re doing something like eating, you are taking an action. And when I mean eating, I don’t mean having lunch, or having dinner, or having a meal. I mean eating to resolve something emotional, eating to resolve some kind of pain or express it. When you’re doing something like eating to resolve emotions or conflict, you are taking an action, and therefore you are diminishing your sense of powerlessness.

Similarly, psychoanalyst Axel Hoffer, another one of my awesome mentors … Axel, you’re the best. Axel Hoffer and Dan Buie believe that helplessness underlies other intolerable feelings such as incompetence, shame, embarrassment, humiliation, weakness, panic, isolation, rage, and hate. How about that?

So, thought of it this way, helplessness in itself is a traumatic condition. Anger, productivity, withdrawal, and denial are ways of distracting from helplessness. So often, that anger is turned on oneself. I can’t believe how much I weigh. I can’t believe how much I ate. I am so mad at myself as a way of dealing with helplessness. Helplessness is an ultimately, penultimate passivity. Can’t do anything. But, anger is active. So, we’d rather feel active, and angry, and energized, even if it means hating on ourselves. Then, we want to feel helpless against situations or people who treat us badly.

Active is an active emotion whereas helplessness is a passive emotion. You can get angry with yourself or your weight. You could be upset with yourself or what you’re eating, or the amount, or what have you, or anything else, drinking, gambling, anything, doing something you don’t want to do, not doing something you want to do. You can get mad at yourself for that as a way of avoiding your sense of helplessness because you are in an active state.

Productivity is another way of dealing with helplessness. Being busy is a way of turning passive to active. So focusing on achievements, productivity, being a slave driver to yourself … And this is where the, “Well, during this time of quarantine, I’ve written three novels. I started a screenplay. I also started an organization and learned French.” You know those people? I might be one of those people at times. I admit it. Those people who just turn passive to active by being super, super, super busy. And when you’re busy, you don’t feel the passivity of helplessness. These are all strategies to distract from helplessness. Thinking about food, weight, and calories are examples of focusing on doing rather than feeling.

 

Withdrawal. Withdrawal is also a way of denying helplessness. If you’re avoiding people, if you’re … Ronan, I’m getting a message that someone is trying to call in and they’re not getting an answer. Oh, wait. I have a caller. Hello, caller.

Jenny:
Hi, this is Jenny.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Hi, Jenny. I was just talking about you.

Jenny:
Hi. I heard that. Thanks for reminding me about … I need to add rosé to my shopping list.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
I’m glad you haven’t lost your sense of humor during all of this.

Jenny:
No. Actually, something you said really struck a chord with me just now when you were saying … And not even the helplessness, the what people are doing to kind of combat the helplessness by making themselves super busy and taking courses, and learning seven languages, and writing a novel, and whatever. It’s interesting that you said that because I have friends who keep calling me to check in to make sure I’m not drowning in my rosé. They’re like, “Well, what have been doing?” And I feel pressured to … I don’t know. To tell them what I’ve been … Like, “Well, I’ve been organizing my closet.” It’s like they are judging me for … I’m like, “Why can’t I just be doing nothing? I mean, isn’t this the time where we can feel like we can do nothing? Because there’s not a lot to do” I’m just trying to relax because I feel like if I overwhelm myself with taking 7,000 courses and doing all this stuff that I’m actually going to make things worse for my mental stability.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Yes. So, you know what’s good for you. And for you, relaxing and taking this time to recharge, relax provided you’re not-

Jenny:
Yes.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
That’s good for you. Know thyself. If you know what’s good for you, then that’s what you stick to. I would say, are they judging you? They might be. Or are you judging you through their eyes? I don’t know. But if they are judging you, it’s probably because you not being busy and learning 17 languages and now you can speak Swahili and … I mean, I’ve heard people learning some interesting languages that they will never use or they’re working on … I started a YouTube channel. I’m doing this, and I’m doing that. Apparently they don’t sleep.

Jenny:
Yes.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
If you relax, that might put them in touch with their own anxiety about helplessness that they are covering with all of this do, do, do, do, do, busy, busy, busy. It’s learning like you may be helpless in the face of their judgment. So, it’s like coming to terms with, okay, I can’t change them from being judgemental, but I can change the way I feel about them being judgemental.

Jenny:
Yeah. Okay. Yeah, I feel very judged, like I’m supposed to be doing all these things. Why can’t I just be, like you said, recharging, walking my dog, relaxing? Because honestly, I mean, this whole situation, what you’re talking about helplessness, it’s been … My whole life I’ve felt helpless. I grew up with an alcoholic parent. You can’t fix that, and it’s a helpless feeling. Then, in my adulthood, you’re faced with a lot of things. Then, especially this pandemic has really broughten to light the fact that we’re truly helpless in this situation and we have to come to some sort of … We have to come to terms with that and just find peace with it in a way.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Yes. And that’s hard.

Jenny:
It’s hard. And for me, when I have a panic attack, that is like the true form of helplessness for me where your body just turns on you. You just have to kind of ride the wave is how I … And right now, that’s kind of what mentally am doing. I’m riding this wave. Because normally, my life is very busy with work, and dog, and socializing, and traveling. Other than the dog part, which is the same, I can’t do any of those things right now because of the pandemic. So, I’m just trying to ride the wave. Ride the wave. And for that, for me, it means not overwhelming myself because that is what causes me to feel helpless and then in turn have panic, and anxiety, and all that stuff.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
And that is a healthy attitude.

Jenny:
Yes. And drink rosé, lots of rosé.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Well, look, as long as you are … I would say as long as you’re recognizing what’s … You’re kind of laughing, kind of joking, kind of not, I imagine.

Jenny:
Yes. Yeah.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
But, as long as you are recognizing why you are turning to that rosé, just as I tell people, “Well, it’s not that you’re eating cookies or ice cream. It’s why.” And then addressing that. So if you’re feeling lonely and you’re feeling anxious and rosé alleviates that, well, rosé is not the problem. Rosé is the solution to the problem. It’s just maybe not a solution that you want to always rely on. So, resolving the loneliness. And there might be no way of dealing with the loneliness in a pandemic or … But, just having a different relationship to that need and acknowledging it, and to soothing yourself with words helps you not turn so much to rosé, or ice cream, or whatever it is that people are using to help themselves.

Jenny:
Yes. Totally.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
And if you have friends who are judgemental and you feel bad when you talk to them and they say, “Well, what are you doing? What are you doing with all this, with the intimation that you should be doing 5,000 things?” maybe those are people you don’t want to talk to as often. Or you just change the subject.

Instead of having to defend, and explain, and justify, you could say, “I am doing absolutely nothing, and I love it. So, what’s going on with you?” When you’re in a position where you have to defend yourself to people, or explain yourself, or justify, it’s awful because you’re never going to do it. You’re going to say, “Well, it’s really good for me to really recharge.” Someone who organizes themselves as being super productive as a way to deal with their anxiety is never going to go, “That’s great. You do that.” They’re going to say, “But, you should be doing more stuff.” So, that’s why not wasting your breath and being able to just say, “Hey, you know what? I’m not even doing anything. I do nothing, and I love it. So, what about this?” That’ll shut them up.

Jenny:
Yes. I feel like that is what I’m going to start saying. Because I’m making things up. I’m like, “Well, I walk the dog, and I organize my … I sanitize.” I mean, I’m just making … Not that I’m not doing these things. I am, but it’s like, you know?

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
You’re trying to prove yourself. Here you are trying to prove yourself to your friends. I’m organizing my entire house. I’m taking longer walks, and I’m doing this. Please give me the seal of approval. Well, it’s not going to happen. So you give yourself the seal of approval and you say, “Those people can’t be with themselves. I can be with myself. They might not be able to be with themselves. This is their way of coping. That’s their way of coping. It doesn’t have to be mine.”

Jenny:
Yes.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Well, Jenny, I am so glad that you called. I hope I gave you some food for thought about what’s going on.

Jenny:
Yes. Thank you. I always appreciate talking to you. You make me feel better.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
I’m so glad. Let me know. Give me a call back next week and let me know if you have one of those conversations. Or even if you don’t, call me anyway. And let us know how it goes, how you can have a different tact with these types of friends.

Jenny:
I will. Thank you, Dr. Nina. Thank you. Have a great day.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
You, too. Thanks, Jenny.

Jenny:
Bye. Bye.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Bye. Well, Ronan says I have two more callers, so who’s up, Ronan? Who’s up next? Ronan? Nicole.

Nicole:
Dr. Nina?

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Nicole, it has been so long.

Nicole:
Hi.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
So good to hear from you.

Nicole:
I know. Oh my God. It’s so nice to hear your voice. I’ve been following your posts on Instagram. Anything you post just resonates in another way. I was just reflecting. I feel like I’m … I’m not perfect. No one’s perfect. But to just feel like … I’m more aware when I’m eating. And I’m like, “Well, it’s not what I’m eating. It’s what’s eating at me.”

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Yes.

Nicole:
I saw the article that they published that you’re in, which is amazing. It’s just been … I don’t know. Things are okay. Things are good. I still have my moments. Sometimes it’s hard to relapse or come back, but I’m just trying to be more compassionate and loving with myself. I know we did some role playing in the past, and you said something to me like, “Well, what would you tell to your best friend or someone that you love?” I feel like I’m using that in different situations that have nothing to do with even food but just the psychology of just being loving and compassionate to yourself and acknowledging and this whole everything. Everything you’ve taught me has been so useful. Thank you.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
I’m so happy to hear that. And remember that thoughts and beliefs, some of which are conscious and some of which are unconscious, lead to feelings, which lead to behavior. So, that is why focusing on the behavior gets you nowhere. You have to be able to change the way you think, change your thoughts, change your beliefs, both the ones that you are aware of and the ones that are hidden from you, that are in your unconscious. It changes the way you feel. And when you change the way you feel, you’re less likely to, say, focus on weight, food, and all of that as a way of distracting from uncomfortable things and learn new ways of being responsive to yourself when you feel bad. No one has ever been mean to themselves and made themselves feel better.

Nicole:
That’s so true. I think one of the things that I’m still struggling sometimes is sometimes I can’t pinpoint what’s eating at me, so I don’t know what’s actually going on or how to solve it.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Well, if you don’t know what’s eating at you, two things to do. One is to say, “If I weren’t focusing on this food, weight, whatever, my body, what would I be worried about? What is it I don’t want know? What do I know that I don’t want to know? What is it that I’d be worried about?” Because you know what? There’s that voice, right? When you just don’t want to know something, you kind of know it but you just distract from it, what is it I don’t want to know?

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
And the other is my food-mood formula because I developed my food-mood formula because people get so quick at focusing on food that they bypass what’s going on with them. So if you’re focusing on … If ice cream is your thing and it’s creamy and smooth, that means comfort. If it’s filling, bulky, kind of pasta, pizza, hamburgers, big food that takes up space, that’s about loneliness or filling a void. And anything crunchy, chips, pretzels, whatever, is-

Nicole:
Frustration or no?

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
It’s frustration which is a form of anger. Anger, which is irritation, which is irritation, frustration, annoyance, all of those things. And remember, why do we go to food in the first place? This is so important to remember. Because food is associated in our psyche as our very first experience of being feed is connected with being held as infants, as babies, being held, feeling safe, feeling that sort of blissful connection with the person who’s feeding us. And that’s why in our psyche food equals a safe relationship. We don’t think of it that way consciously. We just think, “Ooh, I want that.” But when we think about comfort food, we really want to be comforted.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
So remembering that this is your way of resolving something. Maybe it’s something relation in your life. Maybe it’s something that’s bothering you. What is it? Just being curious, not critical, more likely to find the answer.

Nicole:
I like that a lot. I think that just exploring it a little bit. Thank God I feel blessed, lucky, grateful. I’m working. I’m making money. I have a lovely boyfriend who’s really invested in me, and my growth, and my well-being. He’s been really busy studying for his helicopter … He wants to be a helicopter pilot. So, the exam is finally coming up, and he’s been really busy and preoccupied studying for that. So, I’ve just been trying to give him space. But, maybe a part of me’s just frustrated. Or even though he’s there, maybe I’m feeling lonely or … But, I don’t know. I don’t want to be needy either, so it’s like I don’t know.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Whoa. Nicole. You just went from having needs to not wanting to be needy. You have to think about having mixed feelings. A part of you is supportive of him and his helicopter license stuff, and a part of you wishes he was around more. A part of you-

Nicole:
Right.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
A part feels this, and a part feels that. So, a part of you is enjoying time to yourself and a part of you is missing him. Don’t confuse having needs with being needy.

Nicole:
Okay. I like that. If you hear me typing is I’m just taking notes.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Well, you know this will be posted. It’s made-

Nicole:
IG?

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
No, no. It’s posted-

Nicole:
Oh.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
It’s posted on the LA Talk Radio archives, but it’s also posted as a podcast on Apple Podcasts and anywhere you get podcasts, so …

Nicole:
Awesome. I didn’t know that. That’s helpful.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Yeah.

Nicole:
So, okay. I like that.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
So, you don’t have to type. You can listen to it later.

Nicole:
All right. Just take it in. Okay. I kind of take that in. I was listening to the caller before me. I want sure who it was, but she was talking about rosé.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Jenny.

Nicole:
And it’s not about the rosé. Yeah. So, I kind of found during quarantine … I don’t know if it’s become a habit, but I like to pour a glass of wine or two in the evenings, whether it’s rosé or red. It’s been rosé, too, lately, so I kind of could relate to her. I don’t know if it’s just become habit, or if I’m turning to it for a specific reason, or if I’m turning to it because I’m telling myself I shouldn’t have it. So, I don’t know if that’s kind of something I’m exploring as well so I can …

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
What’s it doing for you? I mean, look, there’s nothing wrong with having a glass of wine or so. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with having a glass of wine with dinner, or at night, or whatever, or two. But, are you overly relying on it to relax than maybe-

Nicole:
I don’t think so. I think it just reminds me of summer. It’s summer, and I want to travel. And I can’t really travel right now. So, it also just makes me feel like we’re celebrating. We’re happy. I guess it’s just the … The emotions that I connect to it is like vacation.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Okay. So, you associate it with vacation, the vacation that you’re not having. So, it brings that sense of vacation, and celebration, and reward, and all of that fun. It brings you that when you’re deprived of having the actual experience.

Nicole:
So, maybe I should just go have the actual experience, even if nobody wants to come. Just have it by myself.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
That might be hard to do right now.

Nicole:
I know.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
And that’s where you go back to the helplessness of, hey, I want to travel, and I can’t. I can’t. It’s not safe. The world is shutting down. Can’t even get on the plane and go anywhere. Oh, I can’t change that.

Nicole:
So maybe just being loving, and compassionate, and being like, “Hey, you know what? This is the closest alternative, and it’s okay to enjoy a glass or two of wine in the evening with dinner as long as I’m not abusing it or looking for something in it, but just to enjoy.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Yes. Exactly.

Nicole:
Yeah? Okay.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
And you see how … See how that’s just a … There’s no guilt about it. Then it’s just okay. I recognize why. It’s the circumstances that we’re in now. If I find myself having to have it every night and it’s not good if I don’t have it, then maybe I’ll look at that as a problem if it goes on for six months. But right now, this is something that I’m doing, and I know why, and I’m not abusing it. It sounds like using it, not abusing.

Nicole:
Then, Saturday, I went out with my girlfriends. We went to Elephante, which is like this restaurant bar in Santa Monica. We ordered a bottle of wine, and we had a few glasses. I ended up making not the best food decisions or choices. So, I’ve also kind of had a difficult time coming back from that, but I think I’m slowly … And with the gyms closing … The gyms are closed now. Even the Pilates studies and stuff are closed. I feel like I just want to exercise sometimes and it’s hot outside. So, I don’t know. I have a trainer coming to my apartment, but I’ll let you speak. Sorry.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Exercise because it’s good for your body, not because you ate what you consider the wrong food at dinner. Hold that. Hold those thoughts with you.

Nicole:
Okay.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
And again, you can listen to … You’ll be able to listen to this on Apple Podcasts or the LA Talk Radio archives. But, I’m so glad that you called.

Nicole:
Thank you. Thank you for having me and for your words. I appreciate it.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Please call back and let me and us know how you’re doing. Because you’re the weekly caller.

Nicole:
I know.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
I’ve heard from a lot people who said, “What happened to Nicole?” So, it’s really good to hear from you.

Nicole:
I’ll be back. Thank you so much. Have a great day. Thank you. Bye.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Bye-bye. I know Karlygash is waiting in the wings. Karlygash? Karlygash? Are you there? Maybe Karlygash dropped out. Well, Karlygash, if you get this, please call back.

Karlygash:
Hello.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Oh, there she is. Hi, Karlygash.

Karlygash:
Hi, Dr. Nina. Good to hear. How are you?

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
I’m fine. Thank you.

Karlygash:
I am really different every day. And still, this keeping my own down reason. Putting myself first is still an issue for me. I’m working on it. So, two days ago, I got into a minor accident, car accident, that somebody bumped me from behind. The guy came out, and he’s like, “I’ll give you cash.” I’m like, “Okay, let me think first. Let me put myself together.” I’m fine, but still. He was like, “I have [inaudible 00:36:13]” I’m scared sometimes when [inaudible 00:36:15]. Sometimes I have this when they, not shout at me, but being aggressive or pushy. He was not. But, then he was testing me like … I said, “Okay, let me get your documents, and then I’ll call my insurance. Then, I’ll tell you what I’m going to do.” Because I didn’t want to talk to him. He was kind of, I don’t know, pushy.

Karlygash:
Then, he said, “Let me talk to your friends. I’ll give you cash.” I said, “I don’t know what … I cannot tell you anything. Just give me documents. Let’s do everything how it’s supposed to be done.” Then, I’m like, “Why would you even talk to my friends? It’s me who is the car accident, person who was in the accident. Why would you talk …” So, he was trying to keep me. He was like … Something was weird.

Then, I noticed that I’m to be less, maybe, apologetic or give less freedom to people in my life or just controlling to what I tell them. Because I have this kind of idea when I go out to the world I still am like a kid trusting everyone, thinking that everyone is good. And I really do think that people are good, even like the evil ones. They good intent, but maybe they don’t know how to come to the brighter side or something. And just there’s kind of person who’s very kind, but then …
I expect when I say things, I expect good treatment or something. I don’t know. But, then some people, they just use this information and manipulate it against me. Then, I have to deal with a whole bunch of their manipulation based on what I tell them. And I’m like, “Oh my God. Will I need to always be in awareness?” Sometimes I really want to be surrounded by people where I don’t have to be aware, where I can just relax and be with them trusting them. I do have such friends in my life, but …

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Those are called friends. That’s why we want to choose our friends carefully because-

Karlygash:
This is called what?

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Friends. Friends.

Karlygash:
Friends?

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
You want to be surrounded by people who are respectful and with whom you feel safe and all of that. Those are friends. Friends.

Karlygash:
Yes.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Sometimes in our lives we encounter someone like the guy who rear-ended you how are maybe aggressive, and pushy, and a little bit misogynistic if he’s saying, “Let me talk to your friend,” instead of to you. Then, we just say, “Oh, I know.” Like the guy who mask shamed me. That guy’s not going to change his attitude. The guy who rear-ended you is not going to change his attitude. We have to just realize who we’re dealing with and act accordingly, but not say, “Oh, see, people can’t … People are scary.” This person is a misogynistic guy.” Not all guys.

Karlygash:
That’s true. He was very misogynistic.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Yeah.

Karlygash:
I felt the absolute message like, “You know, you’re a stupid woman. I’ll talk to someone who helps you.” So, that was very unpleasant. Now, I realize that it’s an abuse and it’s … It’s abuse in its first place. You’re not considering me as a person, capable, whatever. And again, in the same situation, what I felt was, again, I couldn’t put myself first because I felt so sorry for the guy because he didn’t seem very healthy person. You know how people are fit and some people have sagging eyes. You feel like something’s going on internally, physically.

Then, he was a veteran. He had this veteran on his license plate. And he had handicap on his license plate, the sign. And I was like, “Oh, no. I’m so sorry for the guy.” Then, I was like, “I’d rather get cash and not cause problem for him. But, wait a minute. First of all, I don’t know what happened to my car. I need to check.” Because last time when I had the same impact, my car was totaled because the guy … It was not big hit, but he hit it somehow wrong and then the car was not drivable. I said, “wait a minute. If my car is not safe, I need to check it.” [crosstalk 00:40:36].

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Karlygash, this is great. This is great.

Karlygash:
But honestly, I felt so bad at the very beginning. It’s, again, the handicap situation where I cannot say no to my mom. Then, he is handicap and he’s a veteran on top of that. I’m like, “Oh my God. I cannot do this to this guy,” thing. But then, I’m like, “And then what will I do if my car is not safe? Or what will happen if tomorrow I wake up with neck pain and needed to go to see a doctor or something. Who’s going to cover those expenses?

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
I love that you were able to catch the connection between this guy with the handicap sticker and your mom who has a [inaudible 00:41:23].

Karlygash:
I thought it only now talking to you.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
A different kind of-

Karlygash:
You have this magical thing, Dr. Nina. When you listen, somehow I become smart, you know? When I’m talking to you.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
I don’t think it’s about me listening that brings out your smartness. I think you’re smart and you just … And this is what I mean about being curious and not critical. When you’re critical, you might have said something like, “Why do I always give up myself to take care of other people, even this stranger? What’s wrong with me?” And you wouldn’t get anywhere. But, you said to yourself, “Huh, why am I doing this? Why am I automatically putting him first above me? Oh. Yeah, this reminds me of my mother. So, I see how I was sort of conditioned and programed to give up me to take care of them.” And you caught it because you were curious. So, pat on the back on you.

Karlygash:
Thank you. Pat on the back. And I only now realize it. But back then, when I was thinking and I made decision to go through the insurance, I couldn’t analyze it like this, like I did today, and like you said. But, I was thinking, “You know what? I just need to take care of myself. I understand that the guy’s a veteran and handicapped, but I hope that he is well insured. And I hope that his veteran whatever organization will take care of him. I hope that he is supported well. At least car is huge and nice, so he seems to be doing not so bad.” So I’m like, “Let me take care of me.”

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
And Karlygash, he hit you. His car hit your car.

Karlygash:
I know. That’s the thing.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
You sort of forget about you when you’re talking about this. It’s like, “Well, I hope he has good insurance. I hope he this. I hope he that.” Well, he hit you. He hit you. And you get to think about you. I hope you have good insurance. I hope you didn’t get whiplash. I hope you are okay.

Karlygash:
Thank you so much. It’s an excellent catch. Thank you so much. And it comes back to when I called you two or three weeks ago talking to when I know that people are in trouble, like my friend, whose friend is … whose daughter is fighting now, or my mom who’s handicap. When I know that people have some excuse in life, I’m like, “Okay, I need to get down or whatever, and sacrifice myself.” I still am exploring this theme. Want to liberate from it. And yet, again, appear that that I’m very grateful for this situation that it came up. Now I can see that it’s deeply rooted in me, and I really need to work on it. Really, like stop caring too much about everyone and like … Or like at work, hey, people’s pain is that much. I need to take care of them that much. Not just give my whole soul, and mind, and everything.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
And start taking care of you.

Karlygash:
Yes.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
You have to give them-

Karlygash:
And as a result that … Of course, as a result, that day I binged. I’m sorry to say, but it was first day of my period, and so I was in pain already, and he hit me. It was so bad. As a result, I overate. I binged that day. Then, I said, “I know. I’ve been in trouble, and today I used old mechanism to soothe myself,” and I wasn’t very harsh on myself. I felt sorry that I did it, because I want new behavior. But, then I said, “I’ve been to accident. Of course it affected me.” This is how far my analyzing went that day, and then I-

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
You can’t see me, but I am so happy right now because … you didn’t harshly do that thing you talked about a few weeks ago. See with that second voice says that the I. Okay, I know why I did it. Oops. I know why I did it. I understand, and I have to be compassionate with myself. This is the progress, not … And the more that you do that, the more you support yourself.

Karlygash:
Oh, thank you. Oh my God. This is the progress. Thank you.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
This is the progress. Because the less you’re going to binge because you’re going to be able more and more to be supportive of yourself.

Karlygash:
I hope so.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Instead of giving everything to some random stranger who rear-ends you, you can give to yourself.

Karlygash:
I hope so.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
You’re doing it.

Karlygash:
I hope so.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
I know so.

Karlygash:
Thank you.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
I’ll hold the hope for …

Karlygash:
Thank you so much. Then, they continued that … Yesterday, I got some news from Kazakhstan from my home city. Situation with corona is so bad there. People are dying. Literally, somebody said people are dying like flies there, just falling. And there are not enough medical personnel. Many medical doctors, they just took vacations because they’re scared to go to work because people are dying like this. Like in every apartment building, there are four, five people dying. Then, they are calling the medical students, those who haven’t finished their studies yet, because they don’t have medical personnel, and it’s so bad. And two of my relatives died. I just found out yesterday. It’s just it was hard-

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
I’m sorry.

Karlygash:
… honestly, on top of that. It just hit me with now my people are dying. Although it’s hard and I know everyone’s facing it, but in Kazakhstan it’s hard now, not like … There are less resources, and my people are struggling. I talked to them the whole day yesterday, the whole night, and tonight and the morning helping them at least feed them. And I noticed that it’s just hard when your people around you suffer and you cannot do anything with that. It’s just really hard, honestly.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Yes.

Karlygash:
And I feel much … Thank God I didn’t feel guilty for being here in America and to some extent being safe. It’s still everyone is weak in front of this virus. Anyone can get sick. But, at least here I know you can get treatment or whatever. Over there, people just done come. People just die in hospitals. Not enough hands, you know? Not enough hands to handle them.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Karlygash, I’m so sorry that your country of origin, and you’ve lost family members, and, to your point, the helplessness over it, and coming to terms with that, and dealing with grief, and fear, and all of that is so important. I just hope that you can take care of yourself during this difficult time, continue taking care of yourself. Unfortunately, I’ve got to go because we’re now over our time. But, I am so glad to hear that you are shifting just a little bit, shifting that critical-

Karlygash:
Thank you.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
… mean voice and cultivating a kinder, more compassionate stance with yourself. That’s everything. That’s everything.

Karlygash:
Thank you so much. Your acknowledgment means a lot to me because sometimes … Not very often I don’t see my own progress. It still shows like I’m trying to understand things. But now once what you’ve said, that’s true. I’m a little kinder to myself in my head. Because before, like two years, oh my God, it was so rough.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
And even listen-

Karlygash:
It was so hard.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Go back and listen to a show from maybe six weeks ago and listen now. I think you’re going to hear a difference. So, thank you Karlygash.

Karlygash:
Thank you so much.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Thank you for being part of the show and sharing your heart and your pain.

Karlygash:
Thank you, Dr. Nina, for existing, being, and so generous for sharing with us your wisdom and your, really, working knowledge. Thank you so much. I’m forever grateful.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Thank you, Karlygash. Call me next week. Let us know how you’re doing.

Karlygash:
I will. Thank you so much.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
Bye for now.

Karlygash:
Bye-bye. Have a good day.

Dr. Nina Savelle-Rocklin:
And that is our show for today. Thank you so much for joining me here on the Dr. Nina Show on LA Talk Radio. I am here doing the show live every Wednesday at 10:00 AM Pacific. You can listen later or watch later. I also post this on YouTube. Break Free From Binge Eating with Dr. Nina. That’s my YouTube channel. You could you see these episodes here as well, there as well. Everyone, please be safe, be healthy, and be curious, not critical. Have a great week, and I’ll see you next week. Bye for now.

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